http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/southafrica/8235196/Presumed-guilty-a-personal-plea-for-my-cousin-Shrien-Dewani.html
Has this article been written by the same guy who wrote the now famous 'complaint letter' to Richard Branson??
Max Clifford is a parasite, feeding off others misery and loving every minute of it.
On a more serious note, the only things that don't add up in this story is that they left the man completely alone and apparently didn't sexually assault his wife before they killed her. Those 2 facts give some credence to the accusations. However if he is innocent then I feel terribly sorry for him.
Has this article been written by the same guy who wrote the now famous 'complaint letter' to Richard Branson??
Max Clifford is a parasite, feeding off others misery and loving every minute of it.
On a more serious note, the only things that don't add up in this story is that they left the man completely alone and apparently didn't sexually assault his wife before they killed her. Those 2 facts give some credence to the accusations. However if he is innocent then I feel terribly sorry for him.
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Take note of what William Booth has to say. He is quoted in this article.
Ten years ago I was arrested on false charges. The SAPS tried to persuade the District Surgeon to make a false report. They planted evidence. Manipulated witnesses. They also gave me two chances to run for it while I was in their custody. If I had I would have been shot in the back. The chargers were dropped, then broguht back and then finally cropped without giving any reasons.
Ten years ago I was arrested on false charges. The SAPS tried to persuade the District Surgeon to make a false report. They planted evidence. Manipulated witnesses. They also gave me two chances to run for it while I was in their custody. If I had I would have been shot in the back. The chargers were dropped, then broguht back and then finally cropped without giving any reasons.
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Shrien has no chance of being fairly judged in SA. The SA state want him guilty, their motives are clear, and their flimsy evidence is based on the state conducted rehearsed hearsay of cheats and crooks. Whilst the motive to have him convicted is obvious what is not clear is Shrien's motive for killing Anni?
As an ex-South African I am appalled by the SA media coverage and Shrien's presumption of guilt without trail. Reminds me of the apartheid era when that regime used any means at its disposal to demonize the indigneous people even distorting history in the school cirriculum. As Betrand Russell once wrote: "When a man writes his autobiography he is expected to show a certain modesty; but when a nation writes its autobiography there is no limit to its boasting and vainglory."
As an ex-South African I am appalled by the SA media coverage and Shrien's presumption of guilt without trail. Reminds me of the apartheid era when that regime used any means at its disposal to demonize the indigneous people even distorting history in the school cirriculum. As Betrand Russell once wrote: "When a man writes his autobiography he is expected to show a certain modesty; but when a nation writes its autobiography there is no limit to its boasting and vainglory."
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Very written and full of more logic than the Pope at prayers. Congratulations to the telegraph for having the guts and the fairness to print this plea from the heart. This not sensationalism, this is to allow the public to understand the corruption and the machinations that exist in other countries. Well done Akta and Andrew.
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"The Cape Town papers are full of half-truths and blatant lies and propoganda around this murder, being leaked by the police. Bonfire of the Vanities indeed."
this is not Bonfire of Vanities. The actual killers were caught in few days. But it seems to make little sense. Why would they do what they did. They made it so easy
Can Max Cliffords' media operatives please take the day of for once
this is not Bonfire of Vanities. The actual killers were caught in few days. But it seems to make little sense. Why would they do what they did. They made it so easy
Can Max Cliffords' media operatives please take the day of for once
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"The question is then, why would Shrien do this? What does he stand to gain from killing his wife of less than a month?"
Its a good question. Possibly its a way of escaping the marriage issue. Maybe he would be disinherited.
But the biggest problem Shirien faces is : why did his wife's killers let him go? Any policeman would ask this question.
Its a good question. Possibly its a way of escaping the marriage issue. Maybe he would be disinherited.
But the biggest problem Shirien faces is : why did his wife's killers let him go? Any policeman would ask this question.
"You're speculating in order to validate your view."
not really. I was speculating in order to answer your question
But here is another speculation / question . Why does Dewani now show great presence of mind and refuse to go back to South Africa. Yet the case for his defense seems to paint him as a naive bumbling fool, as much as anything else.
Just becasue the SA police is corrupt doesn't mean we can't ask these questions. What would you prefer - everything to be swept under the carpet. They have caught the killers after all.
not really. I was speculating in order to answer your question
But here is another speculation / question . Why does Dewani now show great presence of mind and refuse to go back to South Africa. Yet the case for his defense seems to paint him as a naive bumbling fool, as much as anything else.
Just becasue the SA police is corrupt doesn't mean we can't ask these questions. What would you prefer - everything to be swept under the carpet. They have caught the killers after all.
Brilliant. A man goes to SA for the first time in his life, picks up a driver at the airport and convinced him to kill his wife. The way to do it - is to drive him to a township and have his wife kidnapped, whist leaving himself stranded on the side of a road by the township. An astonishing, dastardly masterplan which is unfoiled by the genius of the completely competent and uncorrupt SA police, who discover footage of him paying the driver for the killing infront of the hotel cameras. The police have saved the day by not only saving Cape Towns tourist industry and putting mastermind, millionaire care home operator (who is also behind other carjacking murders in Cape Town) behind bars.
londonlinks
Today 03:42 PM
The township is actually quite close to the airport and not a million miles from where they were having supper. Dewani and his wife would not necessarily have been aware of the direction in which they were travelling or the purpose of the driver in making a detour.
What the police should be saying to tourists is don't get into a taxi late at night with your wife wearing an Armani watch and a gold and diamond bracelet with an estimated value of £8,500.
Instead what they seem to be saying is don't come to South Africa expecting to kill your wife for £75 - because you won't be able to make monkeys of the police force by getting away with such a crime for that derisory sum.
What the police should be saying to tourists is don't get into a taxi late at night with your wife wearing an Armani watch and a gold and diamond bracelet with an estimated value of £8,500.
Instead what they seem to be saying is don't come to South Africa expecting to kill your wife for £75 - because you won't be able to make monkeys of the police force by getting away with such a crime for that derisory sum.
londonlinks
Today 03:35 PM
It's understandable why the writers of this article no longer practice law: they never learnt to stick to the facts as there is no evidence the couple ever had time to go on safari.
The statement of the driver Zola Tongo should be read in relation to the case: www.MichaelStone.co.uk/tongo
The wife was wearing expensive jewellery including an Armani watch and "gold and diamond" bracelet total estimated by the police at £8,695. The driver's cell phone "contained" the text message about the money being left in an envelope behind the front passenger seat.
Quite why the driver would have wanted this to be confirmed by text message when Dewani was himself sitting in the back seat is unclear - but what is clear is that his phone was "stolen" by the murderers as was Dewani's, so unless these phones have been recovered then we only have the driver's claim to rely on.
If Dewani paid $151 to the driver on Tuesday 16th as alleged for his role in the killing (the murder took place on Saturday) then not only is Dewani incredibly stupid and trusting but he must also be incredibly tight-fisted.
The statement of the driver Zola Tongo should be read in relation to the case: www.MichaelStone.co.uk/tongo
The wife was wearing expensive jewellery including an Armani watch and "gold and diamond" bracelet total estimated by the police at £8,695. The driver's cell phone "contained" the text message about the money being left in an envelope behind the front passenger seat.
Quite why the driver would have wanted this to be confirmed by text message when Dewani was himself sitting in the back seat is unclear - but what is clear is that his phone was "stolen" by the murderers as was Dewani's, so unless these phones have been recovered then we only have the driver's claim to rely on.
If Dewani paid $151 to the driver on Tuesday 16th as alleged for his role in the killing (the murder took place on Saturday) then not only is Dewani incredibly stupid and trusting but he must also be incredibly tight-fisted.
pecan99
Today 02:53 PM
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kingorry
Today 02:35 PM
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kingorry
Today 03:55 PM
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Justice has nothing to do with trial-by- journalism or "go on m'lud let him off. After all, he does own a British passport " and everything to do with evidence and due process.
Two people who, apparently, "practised law" (2 minute read of the book "justice for dummies"?) want you to ignore all judicial process, ignore any reference to evidence, but base everything on personal attacks on the South African people.
If he is guilty, let him rot. If he is not, let him be free. It is not up to two ham-fisted amateurs to decide that fate. Do not insult the intelligence of the British people.
...it is, to my mind, a mis-carriage of justice that the Telegraph saw fit to print their article. Pathetic!
Two people who, apparently, "practised law" (2 minute read of the book "justice for dummies"?) want you to ignore all judicial process, ignore any reference to evidence, but base everything on personal attacks on the South African people.
If he is guilty, let him rot. If he is not, let him be free. It is not up to two ham-fisted amateurs to decide that fate. Do not insult the intelligence of the British people.
...it is, to my mind, a mis-carriage of justice that the Telegraph saw fit to print their article. Pathetic!
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The taxi driver received 7 years off his sentence by giving evidence against Shrien Dewani.. Saffa's, does this not strike you as a little strange?? How on earth can you believe a man who is being sentenced to 20+ years behind bars, and will do or say anything to shorten his sentence?
The chief of police described Dewani as a 'monkey'.. so much for impartiality and a fair trial. The police, the SA media and the courts have already made their mind up.
On the flipside, I have to ask the question.. why didnt Shrien put up a fight?? If i'm held at gunpoint with my newly wed wife, there's no way i would allow myself to be seperated from her.
The chief of police described Dewani as a 'monkey'.. so much for impartiality and a fair trial. The police, the SA media and the courts have already made their mind up.
On the flipside, I have to ask the question.. why didnt Shrien put up a fight?? If i'm held at gunpoint with my newly wed wife, there's no way i would allow myself to be seperated from her.
(Edited by author 3 hours ago)
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".. why didnt Shrien put up a fight?? If i'm held at gunpoint with my newly wed wife, there's no way i would allow myself to be seperated from her. "
the media strategy adopted by Shrien and his pals seems designed to protray Shrien as a wimp. To wimp out is not a crime, to be a helpless trembling man is not a criminal offence
the media strategy adopted by Shrien and his pals seems designed to protray Shrien as a wimp. To wimp out is not a crime, to be a helpless trembling man is not a criminal offence
londonlinks
Today 01:15 PM
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The justice system in South Africa can't be any worse than the UK's. Here one can find people convicted of murder and given a life sentence simply based on a cell confession from one inmate to another - see michaelstone.co.uk
If the South African police have evidence to implicate Dewani then nobody has yet been told it, save for the fact that Dewani is apparently a monkey.
If the taxi driver's claim is right about Dewani then his view isn't shared by the co-accused who deny being involved, let alone admit that Dewani was the paymaster.
The taxi driver has also apparently claimed Dewani may have been involved in a previous murder so if we are to believe this claim, which the SA police are now busily "investigating", then this particular monkey has got very long arms indeed as they can reach to a country he has never visited before.
If the South African police have evidence to implicate Dewani then nobody has yet been told it, save for the fact that Dewani is apparently a monkey.
If the taxi driver's claim is right about Dewani then his view isn't shared by the co-accused who deny being involved, let alone admit that Dewani was the paymaster.
The taxi driver has also apparently claimed Dewani may have been involved in a previous murder so if we are to believe this claim, which the SA police are now busily "investigating", then this particular monkey has got very long arms indeed as they can reach to a country he has never visited before.
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this article is an embarrassment to the Daily Telegraph. It seems a not so transparent media operation is being put in place. How did it get published? Whats it in aid of. It actually reads like an alternate soft focus reality, in effect an admission of guilt......
Is this an example of what money can buy? Spend a little more. Fire Max Clifford, he's out of his depth
Is this an example of what money can buy? Spend a little more. Fire Max Clifford, he's out of his depth
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kingorry
Today 02:42 PM
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"Innocent until proven guilty" is a fundamental principle of our judicial system. It requires us to keep an open mind and remain objective until the criminal investigation has run its course. It does not mean that we should close our minds to any evidence that points to the guilt of the accused.
With that in mind, I find the Telegraph's decision to publish this article incomprehensible. The editors should realize that there is always a case for the defence AND for the prosecution. By concentrating wholly on the defence and its supporters, the Telegraph reports subjectively and thereby distorts the facts of the case. It is doing the same with the Amanda Knox case. The last article "For Amanda Knox innocence is not enough" was quite sickening and an affront to the family of the murdered girl.
With that in mind, I find the Telegraph's decision to publish this article incomprehensible. The editors should realize that there is always a case for the defence AND for the prosecution. By concentrating wholly on the defence and its supporters, the Telegraph reports subjectively and thereby distorts the facts of the case. It is doing the same with the Amanda Knox case. The last article "For Amanda Knox innocence is not enough" was quite sickening and an affront to the family of the murdered girl.
thomasgoodey
21 minutes ago
"There are no jury trials in South Africa, remember."
Nor are there in Sweden.
"Naturally, you ... fear the potential weaknesses of judge-only proceedings, particularly as ... an outsider – whose treatment ... has already been prejudicial." Quite so. Be afraid, Assange. Be very afraid.
BACK TO THE PRESENT SUBJECT
The obvious motivation would be financial, presumably life insurance. Did Shrien Dewani insure his wife's life for a large sum upon marriage? I haven't seen any statement about this, either way.
Moreover, I do not really understand the argument, that the SA authorities want to frame Shrien as the planner, in order to keep SA's reputation as a tourist destination spotless. Which is a better tourist sell? "Come to SA and get shot in one of a thousand random mindless killings" or "Come to SA if you want to kill the person you are with cheaply, because there are plenty of willing hitmen here who are easy to get hold of" ? Seems to me to be a tossup, either way.
Nor are there in Sweden.
"Naturally, you ... fear the potential weaknesses of judge-only proceedings, particularly as ... an outsider – whose treatment ... has already been prejudicial." Quite so. Be afraid, Assange. Be very afraid.
BACK TO THE PRESENT SUBJECT
The obvious motivation would be financial, presumably life insurance. Did Shrien Dewani insure his wife's life for a large sum upon marriage? I haven't seen any statement about this, either way.
Moreover, I do not really understand the argument, that the SA authorities want to frame Shrien as the planner, in order to keep SA's reputation as a tourist destination spotless. Which is a better tourist sell? "Come to SA and get shot in one of a thousand random mindless killings" or "Come to SA if you want to kill the person you are with cheaply, because there are plenty of willing hitmen here who are easy to get hold of" ? Seems to me to be a tossup, either way.
34 minutes ago
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Today 05:49 PM
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48 minutes ago
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Wow. Do you know any of these people? Are you even a person?
One thing is pretty clear from all of this. There may not have been sound reasons for a tourist boycott of South Africa in the 1980s, but there certainly are now. Plenty of other places higher up my list to go. Like North Korea, Iraq and Afghanistan.
One thing is pretty clear from all of this. There may not have been sound reasons for a tourist boycott of South Africa in the 1980s, but there certainly are now. Plenty of other places higher up my list to go. Like North Korea, Iraq and Afghanistan.
Today 05:39 PM
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A case in point....this happened in the Caribbean about a week ago...in Jamaica another area know for its high crime rate.
The alleged Canadian murderer is the brother of a government minister and is a popular elementary teacher of a Catholic school board.
His wife survived to accuse him!!!!!http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/article/913980--ajax-teacher-held-in-jamaica-attack-traumatized
The alleged Canadian murderer is the brother of a government minister and is a popular elementary teacher of a Catholic school board.
His wife survived to accuse him!!!!!http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/article/913980--ajax-teacher-held-in-jamaica-attack-traumatized
Today 05:35 PM
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The Dewani family has friendly ties with the family of the murdered doctor in SA. The doctor's son lives in Bristol. So one cannot imagine that Shrien would naively agree to go to Gugs and spend his time looking over photos in the back seat in the dead of night. And what about the so called walk on the beach? Something happened in SA and the S Africans want to know. My home area is equally dangerous..and some have been know to take advantage of this
Today 05:30 PM
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I tried to understand the writers of this article, but I have some difficulty in fitting in there timeline of things,
''Imagine being Shrien Dewani. No, really: imagine it. In a period of eight weeks''
in eight weeks - from my understanding all this happened, that is the wedding the honeymoon, death and flight home in about two weeks !
And thats the point. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. If this was my love one, there is only one place on earth I would be, and that is in SA. But each to his \ her own. Life fighting extradiction is going to certainly be a lot long than 2 or 8 weeks.
But in general on this case, we the public are only told what others want us to know. There is so much about Mr & Mrs Dewani that is unknown, where they were to live ? where Mrs Dewani was going to work? Are you really a millionaire if the 'cash-flow' is 4 million overdrawn? Fighting extradition will be highly expensive, who pays? Legal aid ?
Wasn't the engagement ring valued at £25k yet alone all the items of watches etc? so what happened to the engagement ring? That would have been worth a fortune in SA
The whole ''saga'' begs answers, at the moment there are no answers, merely questions.
How does Shrien face Anni's family, since they will never let this rest until there is the truth. Is Shrien, therefore not the main witness against these men?
Could there really be a miscarriage of justice if he goes back to SA to sort this mess out ?
''Imagine being Shrien Dewani. No, really: imagine it. In a period of eight weeks''
in eight weeks - from my understanding all this happened, that is the wedding the honeymoon, death and flight home in about two weeks !
And thats the point. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. If this was my love one, there is only one place on earth I would be, and that is in SA. But each to his \ her own. Life fighting extradiction is going to certainly be a lot long than 2 or 8 weeks.
But in general on this case, we the public are only told what others want us to know. There is so much about Mr & Mrs Dewani that is unknown, where they were to live ? where Mrs Dewani was going to work? Are you really a millionaire if the 'cash-flow' is 4 million overdrawn? Fighting extradition will be highly expensive, who pays? Legal aid ?
Wasn't the engagement ring valued at £25k yet alone all the items of watches etc? so what happened to the engagement ring? That would have been worth a fortune in SA
The whole ''saga'' begs answers, at the moment there are no answers, merely questions.
How does Shrien face Anni's family, since they will never let this rest until there is the truth. Is Shrien, therefore not the main witness against these men?
Could there really be a miscarriage of justice if he goes back to SA to sort this mess out ?
thomasgoodey
19 minutes ago
davedavenotdave
Today 05:27 PM
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"one guesses at how many commentators have imagined – even for a moment – what it is like to be Shrien, or a member of Shrien’s or Anni’s families at this time. Not many."
I think everyone wants the man to be guilty because it's less terrible that way than if he really lost his wife in the manner described. Some kind of sordid calculus of misery.
I think everyone wants the man to be guilty because it's less terrible that way than if he really lost his wife in the manner described. Some kind of sordid calculus of misery.
